Citations to be issued as part of 'Share Our Streets' campaign Comments on Stories, posted by Editor, Danville Weekly Online, on Aug 2, 2011 at 6:59 am
Motorists, cyclists and pedestrians may be seeing more attention from Danville Police in the coming weeks as the town's 'Share Our Streets' campaign moves into the second of its three-phase operation. The current phase, which runs through Aug. 15, will have officers issuing warning citations for those who commit traffic infractions.
Read the full story here Web Link posted Monday, August 1, 2011, 4:32 PM
Posted by Bill, a resident of the Danville neighborhood, on Aug 2, 2011 at 6:59 am
Yes, share the street, please talk to the entitled bicyclists that ride double or even more on weekends with a gaggle of bikes taking up an entire lane. They bust through stop signs and red lights and insist on riding up Diablo Road when there is a safer way through Diablo. They cause cars to swerve around them thus going into the oncoming lane of traffic setting up terrible accidents. Ask them if they care, I think you know the response you'll receive.
Posted by Ralph N. Shirlet, a resident of another community, on Aug 2, 2011 at 8:14 am
This article brought a smile to many in our region as we expect the Danville Police to concentrate their ticketing in Alamo where they often visit without need or request. E-exchanges this morning were warning regional neighborhoods to stay out of Danville August 15 through September 9 and use Trader Joe's in Walnut Creek.
Anything to lower the Danville Police's workload, right?
In protest, a group of us are going to be in Danville during that period and walk backwards to keep the wind out of our eyes. We are sure that is against some unknown ordinance in Danville.
Posted by Sprtndad, a resident of the Danville neighborhood, on Aug 2, 2011 at 8:15 am
Right. They are doing this to "reduce the number of accidents". I would bet this is yet another "revenue" raising scheme under the guise of raising awareness. At the end of this program they should show the effectiveness. Were there less accidents as a result? How many tickets were issued before and during comparable periods. What did it cost us for them to create and administer this ticketing scheme. Provide ALL the raw numbers before and after this program including costs and income.
Posted by Allaina, a resident of the Blackhawk neighborhood, on Aug 2, 2011 at 10:24 am
I agree it is partially a fundraising tactic, but I would like to see cyclists put in their place. When Monte Vista HS and the middle and elementary schools are in session in the same area, the cyclists on Diablo Road create dangerous situations for the auto traffic. That road is not meant for cyclists!!!
Posted by Duffy, a resident of the Danville neighborhood, on Aug 2, 2011 at 10:34 am
The Danville Police could park at any one of the Iron Horse trail crossings and hand out tickets by the bushel basket to bicylists who fail to stop at the "STOP" signs posted on the trail where it crosses a street. The bicylists don't realize that their failure to stop puts them at risk.
The fancy radar triggers for the lights do not allow enough time for a driver to react and stop
when the bicyclist blows through the stop sign. Besides the driver is seeing a flashing yellow
light which the Motor Vehicle Code says means caution - not stop!
Posted by drew, a resident of the Danville neighborhood, on Aug 2, 2011 at 12:54 pm
interesting that not a single person on here thinks cars ever do anything wrong!!!!! do bikes need to stop at lights and signs, should they stay in the bike lane...yes. is it always the cyclists fault? no. i can't tell you the number of accidents i've nearly witnessed as a car did something idiotic in danville and endangered a cyclist. i myself have been in an accident in danville because of a car's fault (fault proven by his desire to just pay me off...which i gladly accepted). the idea of the article is SHARE THE ROAD!
lastly, i will say that when you see a large number of cyclist take the lane it is not out of disrespect, it is most often because it is the safest thing to do. law says that you must have 3' in order to pass a bike safely. many of the danville roads do not allow this, thus taking the lane is safest as it forces the drivers to treat the bikes as a full-size vehicle and go all the way around when it is safe to do so.
as a cyclist, believe me, we DO NOT WANT TO BE IN ANY SORT OF CONFRONTATION WITH A CAR. guess who wins that battle...the car every time. given the option we prefer to stay away from cars and irate drivers. just drive sensibly and defensively (remember driver's ed?) and don't act in a privileged manner. we're all humans here, we just need to be respectful of each other.
Posted by sherman, a resident of the Danville neighborhood, on Aug 2, 2011 at 1:06 pm
cyclists have a right to ride on every rode albeit single file....thats what share the road is all about. If a motorist needs to pass it requires that they provide two feet of clearance, typicaly all roads offer a passing opportunity other than maybe a few hundred feet.
Posted by John Tanner, a resident of the Danville neighborhood, on Aug 2, 2011 at 1:15 pm
Guess what, the dingbat philosophies of entitlement continue to rage...
Every cyclist I know also drives a car, including me.
So why do car drivers feel entitled to the road? If the lane is too narrow to pass safely and I am riding my bike, then guess what, you lazy, mad-rushed goons can wait until it is safe to pass. You have NO rights to go the speed limit, you have NO rights to pass dangerously, you have NO rights to endanger a cyclist in any way whatsoever.
The WORST and most flagrant and dangerouse persons on our roadways are car drivers. I would love it if our local police would install electronic speed and red light running traps so that they operated 24 hours a day / 7 days a week. Oh my, how much safer our roads would be and far more enjoyable to drive on.
Posted by Richard, a resident of the San Ramon neighborhood, on Aug 2, 2011 at 1:24 pm
Well said Drew. I think the campaign is well intended and the message is "Share our Streets". That doesn't mean drivers will get rid of those pesky riders or riders will get rid of those joggers on the road. Yes, we all annoy each other on occasion, but it would go a long way if people would just give each other some space to be safe.
Runners and cyclists are drivers too, and they tend to be more understanding and considerate becuase of their experience. Drivers who never tried to share the road in any other capacity are the most likely to be involved in an accident or get their blood pressure up whenever encountering a rider or runner. That being said, I'd like to encourage drivers to get out there see what it's all about. I'm sure you'll walk away with a much better understanding of the circumstances people trying to share the road face every day.
Posted by JT, a resident of the Danville neighborhood, on Aug 2, 2011 at 3:53 pm
jjjjj from Alamo, like the car drivers, who think they own the road? What biker thinks they own the road, really? They are entitled to use the road just like you, and if it means that they get in your way until it is safe to pass, then take a deep breath and wait your turn.
No different than waiting in a bathroom line. Do you push someone aside because you feel more entitled, or do you just hold it in and wait until there is an opening? Even if it means missing a few extra pitches in a ball game or chords in a concert...
Let me guess, you wait. But when you are in the car waiting for a biker you get pissed. You are clearly exhibiting a piss-off attitude of entitlement.
Posted by Julie, a resident of the Danville neighborhood, on Aug 3, 2011 at 9:13 am
Wow! Anyone who thinks bicyclists are more considerate needs to come spend some time on Diablo Road where we get cyclist all day every day and there is no bike lane and no safe place to pass for probably 5 minutes of road, which becomes 10 if you are behind a group of bicyclists who won't ride single file.
And you think we should wait our turn!? They constantly ride through the cars sitting waiting at the light to get in front of the traffic and then make us wait to pass them. How about they wait their turn once in a while!!
Then some stick out their arm to indicate thay are turning, and veer in front of us without even looking or caring to see if it's safe.
And the stop signs in Diablo, which is covered with trees and has terrible visibility, they fly through without ever stopping, even coming out onto a busy Diablo Road.
All we insensitive car driviers ask, is that they follow the laws just like we do, and make it just a little bit easier for us to drive through Danville with worrying about hitting some idiotic bike rider who would risk their life rather than obey a traffic law.
My annoyance with them doesn't come from inpatience, it's becuase I'm terrified I'm going to hit one of them when they make it so hard to avoid them becuase they don't know how to Share the Road!!
Posted by Julia, a resident of the Alamo neighborhood, on Aug 3, 2011 at 9:14 am
Eric, you are absolutely correct. They do a good job in mind control. Safety...those fools on the town council couldn't careless about your safety. I sure in the DPD briefing room every morning the quote of the day is "Ticket them and Ticket them, your future depends on it"
Just a little heads up DPD...watch those pedestrians...they are worse than the bikers.
Posted by Emily, a resident of the Danville neighborhood, on Aug 3, 2011 at 10:21 am
If you are saying you "stop" at every stop sign, as defined by the dmv??? My husband said he could ticket 90-95% of cars and bikes at trail crossings and stop signs because they dont properly "stop" as defined by the dmv! Ever heard of the "California Roll" or "California Stop".?
Posted by whiteflower, a resident of the Danville neighborhood, on Aug 3, 2011 at 10:41 am
It's about that this is brought up. Each time I see bikers riding ON THE LINE not IN the lane, it irks me. It is an unsafe practice! Bikers wouldn't want motorist to be riding on the line either. We all need to stay within the lane (INSIDE the lane)! What is the reason for riding ON the line especially when you are all by yourself?
Posted by Ashley, a resident of the Danville neighborhood, on Aug 3, 2011 at 10:52 am
If cyclists want rights on the road, they should pay for them through a licensing fee. If you choose to use a paved roadway, you should alao have to pay to use it, just like any other form of transportation on it. Also, if they are caught without proper identification for thier ticket, they should be detained until they can provide it. In addition, you cyclists need to stay off roads that are not designed for you. Major roads have a lane for you - stay in it. Iron horse trail is meant for cyclists, runners, etc. Diablo Road and similar venues are not meant for you, so don't be surprised if one of us just nearly misses you. You take that risk when you go on those roads! Roads are meant for getting people from point A to point B, not to cause a major traffic jam by selfish cyclists!!
Posted by Chis, a resident of the Danville neighborhood, on Aug 3, 2011 at 1:36 pm
Dear Ashley and a few others:
I sense a murderous rage in your statements.
I hope you dont kill, intentionally or not, an innocent cyclist (for OMG, riding on a white line!) or mother crossing the street with her babies because you are having a bad day. Go drive your SUV's that are killing our enviornment and hogging the streets!
Its really just a matter of time. Congratulations.
Posted by Ashley, a resident of the Danville neighborhood, on Aug 3, 2011 at 2:45 pm
To Chris and the other cyclists who think they are so important:
Obviously you think cyclists should be above the law and are in a special class by themselves. This is why Critical Mass in SF is such a problem because of people like you. FYI - I own an environmentally friendly car and don't drive frivolously. I am also a mother of 2 and am very conscious about pedestrians as they don't think they own the road!
Posted by Chris, a resident of the Danville neighborhood, on Aug 3, 2011 at 2:55 pm
Again, I hear a angry, perhaps murderous rage in your comments.
From now on, I'll get on the sidewalk whenever I see a small vehical likes yours. Even though riding a bicycle on a sidewalk is not permitted. You didnt know this.
No comments on this board even come close to saying cyclists are "above the law." Educate yourself and speak to an attorney or insurance carrier who handle vehical vs bicycle accidents. The VAST majority of vehical vs cyclist accidents are the fault of the driver...FACT.
Tell the judge how you feel about cyclists when you're going to prison for manslaughter and leaving your children motherless.
Posted by cardinal, a resident of the Diablo neighborhood, on Aug 3, 2011 at 3:14 pm
Cyclists are okay, but those clothes they wear oughtta be banned. I think they cause murderous rages among motorists -- I know I feel it. I also think that ghastly uni syndrome will become to a recognized legal defense to mayhem -- like battered woman syndrome -- for the likes of Ashley.
On a rather more serious note, I am always surprised when I see adults riding with no helmet. I broke one when I went over the handlebars coming down Mt Diablo one time -- had it not been for the helmet, it would have been my noggin that got broke.
Posted by Allaina, a resident of the Blackhawk neighborhood, on Aug 3, 2011 at 3:45 pm
Obviously Chris, cardinal and others cyclists, Ashley has said nothing about klling anyone or even coming close. She has made some very good points about holding cyclists accountable, just like motorists. Why shouldn't a cyclist have some repercussions if they don't have any identification on them? Also, bikes should need to be registered with the state, and why shouldn't it be impounded just like a car if payment is not up-to date.
Usually the only reason someone goes on the attack or gets as defensive as the two of you is because you know what you are doing is wrong. Get a grip and realize you cyclists don't own the road.
Posted by Ashley, a resident of the Danville neighborhood, on Aug 3, 2011 at 4:01 pm
From your responses, you must read everything through angry eyes. It sounds like you think the world owes you and that you are better educated than everyone else. Obviously, you don't like to be told anything and think you are always right. Someday you will get your comeuppance for you behavior...
Posted by Joe, a resident of the Danville neighborhood, on Aug 3, 2011 at 4:06 pm
Isn't there a place where cyclists can ride without creating a dangerous situation for everybody? I just don't understand why a cyclist would risk everything to ride down Camino Tassajara into Dublin. I'm careful not to hit them, but does the thrill for them outway life as they know it? The attitude we all talk about might just be a display of sheer stupidity. I just don't get it.
Posted by Kevin, a resident of the Danville neighborhood, on Aug 3, 2011 at 4:11 pm
The reason for the loud, bright and (I agree, sometimes ugly) clothes is to stand out on the road so people like Ashley and Allaina don't run them down because of their "ownership" issues or to 'make a point.'
Chris is really not that far off here. People who think they are better than others or believe some group doesnt belong, whether it be cyclists on the roads, different races, hair colors, etc, etc tend to be more prone to violence towards that group. Its human nature. Somebody driving a car (which is a deadly weapon) can easily kill/murder someone if they have a bout of rage, which some have clearly demonstrated with their comments. Scary stuff.
Posted by Allaina, a resident of the Blackhawk neighborhood, on Aug 3, 2011 at 4:41 pm
Kevin - Apparently you think cyclists should get a free ride. I love how you brought the race card into it. That has nothing to do with it. As our government keeps trying to push the idea of "paying your fair share", that completely applies here. You cyclists think you own the road, but you certainly don't pay for it.
You cyclists think it is all about you. You think we motorists are all going to run you down. How about you having some common courtesy on the road, especially when certain roads are not designed to have cyclists on them. You are as bad as spoiled children and think we motorists should cater to you as such.
Posted by Allaina, a resident of the Blackhawk neighborhood, on Aug 3, 2011 at 5:48 pm
Obviously from your statement, you don't realize that some of your fees for your CAR registration pay for the roads. I don't believe a car is a bike - do you? Like I stated earlier, bikes should need to be registered as well to "pay their fair share" for roads and their upkeep.
Also, apparently you haven't been on the windy part of Diablo where there is no bike lane and it's barely wide enough for 1 car each direction. Try riding that on a school morning. or even better, a school night when Monte Vista has something going on with the road being pitch black, and tell me that is a wise idea. You may not be one of those crazy cyclists, but they are out there!
Posted by Stephen M, a resident of the Walnut Creek neighborhood, on Aug 3, 2011 at 7:47 pm
These comments are out of control. Please have some tolerance for one another people.
Realize that one time or another in our lives we have all been cyclists and we have all been motorists. I have seen both bad motorists and bad cyclists but I can not say that the entirety of each group is in the wrong. Using words like "we" and "you" makes this debate adversarial when it shouldn't be.
I am a cyclist. I can honestly say that I have many more positive interactions with motorists while I'm on my bike than negative ones. People are generally aware while driving and as long as I'm riding my bike defensively I do OK. I have made mistakes on my bike and people have been gracious.
The majority of cyclist do own motor vehicles and do pay the same amount in taxes be it vehicle, gas, road tolls etc as everyone else does. The law does allow bikes on road ways unless otherwise identified. The argument that they just don't belong holds no weight.
Everyone, please slow down, whether its out of fear of receiving a ticket or just for the sake of respecting your fellow human beings.
P.S. I do believe this is just revenue generation for PD and questioning that philosophy is where the energy in this debate should be directed.
Posted by Pedal Power, a resident of the Danville neighborhood, on Aug 3, 2011 at 11:12 pm
It would be much better to have a yield sign and on demand traffic lights, where the Iron Horse Trail crosses San Ramon Valley Blvd, rather than the present idiotic arrangement requiring every pedestrian and cyclist to stop the traffic on San Ramon Valley Blvd, (in BOTH directions), for a good 20 seconds. For most of the day all but the mobility-challenged would be able to cross this road half at a time, in perfect safety, without any interruption to traffic flow.
And having part time traffic lights would save energy too, (but maybe not enough to offset DPD's revenue collection opportunity).
BTW how about a big thank you to the cyclist-friendly majority of motorists in the Danville/Alamo area. Most wave me on at Iron Horse trail/street crossings, (10:1 over those who don't) even though I habitually slow down to almost a complete stop. THANK YOU!
Posted by Joe, a resident of the Danville neighborhood, on Aug 4, 2011 at 1:16 am
What ever happenned to "Stop, Look, & Listen?" I was, and my kids were raised by pretty simple people. However, we were taught how not to get killed on a bicycle. None of my kids or grandkids would be caught dead riding bikes like some of these folks do.
Posted by Julia, a resident of the Alamo neighborhood, on Aug 4, 2011 at 10:41 am
Wow...lot of activity on this subject.
Just goes to show, we the people are more interested in this BS, rather than the real serious stuff.
I think the town council should take note... Any time you folks plan to mess with the lives of the Danville community by doing something that will cost the community their hard earned money...just do a little mind control and have the editor of the Danville Weekly write about something similar to Car's, bike's and people.
Then when their brains are focused in the direct you point them in...stab them in the pocket book.
Posted by tom, a resident of the Danville neighborhood, on Aug 4, 2011 at 11:26 am
Who wants anyone to get hurt? We all need to do a better job of following the rules. On EL Catitan and the iron horse trail I virtually stop every time in the car to be just sure. And it has saved of couple of people. Yes the bikes ae a problem but some of them are very good also.
I hope the Danville police look at this intersection and issue a few tickets do bikes and drivers also.
Posted by cardinal, a resident of the Diablo neighborhood, on Aug 4, 2011 at 12:31 pm
I think it would be a smart idea to post Stop signs where the Iron Horse crosses any side street. Most drivers slow down, at least, but the ones who don't aren't thinking about the consequences of an injury, costs of defending themselves in the inevitable lawsuit, etc. Note that I don't even care if they ultimately win -- just the cost of a good defense can bankrupt a driver.
Please think before you decide to pursue Your Rights to the exclusion of all good defensive driving sense. And please/please, if your response is about to be: "but/but what about those nasty scofflaw bikers??11!" -- save it. You already said it above.
Posted by Janet, a resident of the Danville neighborhood, on Aug 4, 2011 at 12:43 pm
Wow. I am frankly amazed at the negativity expressed toward bicyclists in this commentary. As a cyclist I can say that so many motorists are very thoughtful and careful in this community. I also try to do my part by abiding the rules of the road. I'd like to clarify a few of these, as well as some common cycling practices:
1. There is no law in California against cyclists riding 2-3 abreast when it is safe to do so. As soon as I hear a car, believe me I will scoot right over--give me a few seconds
2. I ride the white line for a couple of possible reasons, including broken glass/debris in the bike lane which will cause a flat tire, a severe angle down toward the curb, or the white line is actually too close to the edge of the road to ride inside. I need a little room to avoid sticks, rocks, pinecones, etc. As a cycle coach, I teach riders to simply hold their line while being passed by a car--being predictable is sometimes all I can do.
3. When you see me riding down portions of Diablo Road that are unavoidable (I live here), try to keep in mind that I may have been on my bike for several hours. I am making the best decisions I can to keep myself safe, and your briefly required patience is very much appreciated. It is ludicrous in the extreme, Ashley, to tell me "Diablo Road and similar venues are not meant for you, so don't be surprised if one of us just nearly misses you. You take that risk when you go on those roads! Roads are meant for getting people from point A to point B, not to cause a major traffic jam by selfish cyclists!!" I agree that roads are meant for getting people from point A to point B. Think of the traffic reduction if all of those people were on bikes! I ride my bike, and my kids ride their bikes, to the schools on that route. Join us! We're not actually causing the traffic jam (see the thread today on new cluster homes on Diablo Road and potentially 1000 additional car trips).
4. There are many light signals that are not timed for cyclists. We might need a head start to get through an uphill intersection especially, like the corner of Crow Canyon and Dougherty, where a car coming down the hill at 45 as their light turns green is very dangerous.
5. As noted, cyclists all drive cars and pay taxes. How many bike trips equal the wear and tear of one delivery truck on your average roadbed? Not to mention the environmental impact...
6. The law does not require cyclists to have a license. Most do carry ID, often a ROAD ID tag so you know who to call in the unfortunate case of an accident.
7. Cyclists are sited for infractions the same as motorists. I know plenty of cyclists ticketed for running stop signs. The fine is the same, though it doesn't appear on your driving record.
8. The Iron Horse Trail is a lousy place to ride a bike. Runners with headphones, dogs on long leashes, children with scooters are all hazards to cyclists, and we are a hazard to them. At 20 mph, the road is far more appropriate. In fact, think of bikes as tractors or other slow-moving vehicles and treat them the same way.
To all motorists and cyclists: Please be patient, be courteous, and leave a minute earlier, just in case!
Posted by Sprtndad, a resident of the Danville neighborhood, on Aug 4, 2011 at 2:50 pm
If you read through these notes, you will find some good comments (ignore the trash and vitrole, they don't solve anything) Perhaps the big takeaway is that there is a problem with bikes and cars sharing the road. Other than a few minor comments, there doesn't seem to be a problem when bikes are on the iron horse trail, designated bike lanes, dedicated bike riding areas. Where it becomes a problem is when bikes are on roads that crowd us both. Diablo road is a prime example. While bikes may have a right to be there, it's just not safe for even the most sympathetic riders/drivers.
It will be interesting to see who gets the most tickets during the police action. With all the comments above, maybe a better way to handle this is for the police to print helpful tips/laws in the paper or on the web in places we read (Danville Weekly). Do that on a continuing basis. A bunch of tickets has little affect on teaching the population what we need to know about this topic.
Shame on the Danville PD for this blatant money grab to pay the police we contract for by the City Manager that makes over 400k.
Posted by whiteflower, a resident of the Danville neighborhood, on Aug 5, 2011 at 8:35 am
An occasional ride of cyclist ON the line to avoid debris is acceptable. Get on it, get off it. However, riding ON it as a habit as we see many cyclists do cause potential danger to the cyclist and cars on both directions. Have common sense that the lane is for you. When you are on the LINE, you are using part of the car's lane. Are you cycling or are you driving? You can only do one not both.
Please DO NOT RIDE ON THE LINE - Stay INSIDE your own lane as we do with our cars.
21202. (a) Any person operating a bicycle upon a roadway at a speed less than the normal speed of traffic moving in the same direction at that time shall ride as close as practicable to the right-hand curb or edge of the roadway except under any of the following situations:
(1) When overtaking and passing another bicycle or vehicle proceeding in the same direction.
(2) When preparing for a left turn at an intersection or into a private road or driveway.
(3) When reasonably necessary to avoid conditions (including, but not limited to, fixed or moving objects, vehicles, bicycles, pedestrians, animals, surface hazards, or substandard width lanes) that make it unsafe to continue along the right-hand curb or edge, subject to the provisions of Section 21656. For purposes of this section, a "substandard width lane" is a lane that is too narrow for a bicycle and a vehicle to travel safely side by side within the lane.
(4) When approaching a place where a right turn is authorized.
(b) Any person operating a bicycle upon a roadway of a highway, which highway carries traffic in one direction only and has two or more marked traffic lanes, may ride as near the left-hand curb or edge of that roadway as practicable.
Amended Sec. 4, Ch. 674, Stats. 1996. Effective January 1, 1997.
If you read #3, it allows cyclists to stray away from hugging the far right side of a "substandard width lane". Yes, there are times when it is safer to ride in the middle of a lane to prevent an overzealous driver from attempting to pass unsafely. Do you actually see that happening? My guess is very, very rarely.
Relax people. Cyclists are not going to take over the roadways. The simple fact is that we all need to share the road no matter how much you want to disagree.
Posted by Citizen Paine, a resident of the Danville neighborhood, on Aug 6, 2011 at 12:33 pm
I just thought I'd add a comment that I was out/about this AM and was swamped by a tsunami of two-wheelers, who saw fit to pass my truck on a side street on both the curb side And in the middle of the road. They then invaded Sycamore Valley Road, east-bound, and quite a few of them were riding in the right car lane. Not a good strategy, methinks, in terms of the life expectancy of those riders.
Posted by citizen zen, a resident of the Danville neighborhood, on Aug 30, 2011 at 8:49 pm
"Share the road" this is BS, cars should be on the road and bikes on the sidewalk with pedestrians. I am tempted to hit them when they are in the way. It's unsafe for everyone, GET THE BIKES OFF THE ROAD